Re: Hello?

[Dio the Awesome]

I didn't say any of that at all.

I'm saying that even with all the people still visiting the site, there are still no posts being made (outside of this topic), so clearly the people currently here have no interest for one reason or another.

And all the concerns that Sunwolf brought up are very accurate. We have no control over the site. It will stay the same layout, colors, we can add new boards or delete any.

In many ways, the best thing to do is use this forum as a beacon, to gather up anyone here who still wants to roleplay, and move to a site we have complete control over.

[Kaito]

Alrighties I got a mail and here I am. Back a whole long time ago people were advertising their shit through PMs and I was pissed off about it, but the consensus was that I was at fault for getting pissed off, so since my mindset clashed with the 'higher ups', I left.

I doubt any of you even remember me, was only around for the first year or something.

Anyways, do you guys still have some kind of chatroom that is being used? IRC? Jabber preferred.

I'm a programmer and doing a lot of web projects. Don't expect me to raise a site, but I can give you valuable pointers if you need any.

And concerning RPing; I am writing my BA-thesis at the moment and after that I will write for nanowrimo. If you guys would be interested in doing that aswell send me a message, having contact with motivated people is half the battle!

greetings

[Knifey Keith]

Alrighties I got a mail and here I am. Back a whole long time ago people were advertising their shit through PMs and I was pissed off about it

See I knew I wasn't the only one.

[Kaito]

Anyways, if you want to make a new site, please DO make a NEW site. I think another phpbb-clone is not necessary.

Give it some useful features, like a reputation system, an automatic draft saver, automatic loading of new posts plus updating the titlebar, space on the front page to pin favorites and automatically display threads where you had last posted plus an indicator showing how many new replies there were since you last viewed it, tagging threads to browse RPs by category, etc. etc.

As I said, please just don't make yet another standard forum.

[Shekinah]

So I haven't been around in ages. To be honest, I even forgot about this place (not on purpose), and then I received this message from Dio. Remembering how I absolutely loved this site, I decided to see what was going on. I left after someone who I was enjoying a really rp with, never replied anymore. And then basically life happened: I graduated, started doing a master's degree, started planning for my upcoming half-year Asia trip, and so on and so on. And FoG, sadly, left my conscious realm.

I'd like to stay on. I loved it here and some of the best rp's I participated in, were done here, with amazing writers and awesome people. But I also know that I just don't have the same amount of time to spend on rping anymore as I used to have. That's also a reason why I probably wouldn't pay for the site: depending on how much that would be, I would probably not do it because I think I can't make use of it enough to make it worth to pay for it. I'm a poor student and as I said, I'm planning a six month Asia trip, to which purpose all the money I am left with, goes.

I wish I knew what to do about this matter, but thing is: Dio at least reached me. Maybe more will follow.

I will try and help think about everything I can, to be of use for a solution. it's sad that this is happening. I have so many fond memories of this place.

[Dio the Awesome]

Well, I honestly didn't expect responses so soon. I was going to wait until Sunwolf was back on to field some questions (Sunwolf is kinda spearheading the project), but I feel like newcomers need to be brought up to speed. Especially since the thread has become quite large, and not everyone wants to read all this crap.

Fate Foretold has left the site for an indefinite amount of time, probably forever. Since then there are several mods in place running things, but they don't have much control over the actual site, only Fate does. The domain name has expired as well.

The consensus a lot of us have reached is that a new site should be made. Don't worry about the costs involved, several people have already (or soon will) take care of that.

Umm, not sure whatever to say at the moment. I'm sure Sunwolf will have further information when he gets back. Stay tuned to this thread for more news updates!

Also: Kaito, I sure do remember you. I can't remember if we had any Rp's together, but I recognize the avatar. Welcome back.

[Kail DeWraith]

Hey guys! I got the PM from Sunwolf and came running. I have poked my head in and out for a long while since I had left FoG. My reasons for leaving are simple... Work, School, and getting married.

But things have seemed to settle down. At the very least I can post on some Saturdays, most Sundays, and Monday mornings-afternoons definitely. Anyway, I'm down for a new site. I would love to get back to writing. Hopefully you all recognize me. I did most of my RPing with Eternity, Shades of Grey, and Deadeye... Or Gabe... Or whatever his screen name was before he left. Anyway, let's get this going!

[Gadreille]

To be clear, we don't have access to anything related to money. I don't have access to the admin panel, but things like layout change and category/board change are accessible by the [non-creator] admins. We just can't renew the domain name (not necessarily that big a deal) nor remove advertisements (also doesn't have to be that big of a deal).

Like Dio said, when we were trying to post regardless of these issues, no one took the bait. It's only when the site was dead in the water that a surprising amount of you took a sudden interest. However, people like "new" far more than "old", so I guess I get it.

I do still agree with Keith. If ya'll want to role play, this site is still fully operational. Our admin isn't getting in on this conversation because it is one about everyone LEAVING. If however anyone wants to hang out in this ghost of a site, they are more than welcome to, and the current staff will make adjustments as needed (with the exception of anything that touches money.)

[Guest]

\

[Kaito]

Ysopet: your post is lengthy and as far as I have seen, filled with non-constructive subjectivity. As usual, I want to point out that writing more is not going to make any points more valid. You say the IRC was poison yet you do not explain. I would like to know why you think that.

We apparently never listened to you. I have no idea who you even are, man. Wild generalisation there. Please, if you have a point you are trying to make, do it, because I couldn't see what you do try to say with your post, at all.

I'm not trying to be mean (well, a little), just trying to understand what the hell you're talking about

[Knifey Keith]

What I have to say will likely be long-winded and not at all constructive to what you guys are trying to do. But I think it is important nonetheless.

First of all, I want to say that I agree with Knifey Keith. Creating a thread to whine about the activity level you find in FOG after a very long and unexplained absence is like walking into a childs bedroom after leaving him/her unattended for several days. You say, "What the hell is this?" And the child looks at you as if you are the crazy one. If they are mature enough, perhaps they will even say "Well, what did you expect?"

Role-play websites have always been a bit of a problem for advanced writers who enjoy writing. FOG was created with that in mind. Rules and guidelines were established to that effect, and I think they worked great. Bear in mind, I pretty much isolated myself to the Advanced role-playing section. I can write a lot, and I used the Advanced section to my advantage. I can agree that having a minimum requirement in casual does not work out, but I really do not like casual role-playing anyway. I'm in it for the writing, and the stories, and if I'm writing a few sentences, then I am not really doing myself justice. The problem is that people came on here bitching about these requirements. Yes, even the Advanced minimum requirement. Really? I can meet the minimum requirement even when I can't think of anything to write. And if I can't, then the role-play really just isn't that good.

So here is the thing. The problem is not with FOG, which was really created as a haven for good writers who liked writing. The problem, my dear friends whose company I have come to greatly enjoy, is with you. And, yes, even with me. No one can devote their time every day to a website, to post consistently and keep up with several stories at once when they are going to school, graduating, getting jobs, getting married, having kids, losing jobs, getting divorced... you know, RL. There are two names who stick out in my mind who I was greatly enjoying role-playing with until that bastard RL came and stole them away. What hurts, though, is that they never took advantage of the absence thread to explain. In fact, a majority of you don't. When you've had enough, you just take off without a word. And then years or months down the road, you come back. But things aren't quite how you like it. So, after joining and starting several role-plays that seem awesome and garner interest, you find yourself bored again. So you leave. Again. And without making a notice in the absence thread. Again. And then you come back, years or months down the road. Only this time, you see the digital tumble weeds rolling across the barren plain of what was once a fertile field of words and social interactions. And you say, "What the hell is this?"

And I say, "Well, what did you expect?"

If you look back at the websites recent history, you will find all of the effort that Gadreille put into getting this place running again. She ran headfirst into a brick wall again and again and again. Contests that had the same three people showing interest (out of the thirty or so names that would come on!), new role-play sections that had a total of 0 interested players, etc. As you will see, most people simply aren't interested in role-playing. The community that had established themselves here have moved on. A few have come back, and they aren't happy with what they see.

This is your mistake: you think that doing it again, but this time with a different name and a different flavor, might actually work. Well, what do you think FOG is?!?! And this from someone who left several times without a word to explain why until he came back. It isn't going to work, because it never works. It will just be one more dead forum filled with a few good memories... but probably more bad ones. I mean, if there really was an ideal example of a role-play forum where all of this actually worked, wouldn't we be there? Didn't we think that this place was it, once upon a time?

If you want to try this venture, don't let me discourage you. But I won't try blindfold you to the harsh realities of the internet role-playing world. People, in general, are unreliable. People you know over the internet are even more so. But, if you want to do this, then like any business you need to do it. "I'll only start this business if a couple of thousand of people pledge to buy something from me" isn't going to work. Find a niche and fill it, and the people will come. Until they get bored of your product. But if you are going to siphon the remaining life out of this derelict, what was once a shining beacon of the e-literate (to use Kalon's glorious term), I think you've been here long enough. FOG is not a waypoint to trample upon what once was as you guide your new sheep to their next disappointing pasture. You got what you came for, now go create the website and do your business from there. Otherwise, you will NEVER separate yourself from FOG. Ever. And if you don't realize that, then all of your adamant denials that it is a FOG II are just lies.

Oh, and as a side note (perhaps you will take it into consideration in your new home), the poison that really killed this place was the IRC. Why do you think Fate tried to get rid of it? And was her attempt met with understanding and open arms? No, it was not. Like a cigarette, you all inhaled that poison, embraced its noxious fumes, and then left the catasprophe to the truly dedicated, like Gadreille (and as befits those who have committed sin, they now reside in Role-Play Hell). Well, the damage has been done. It was only a matter of time to begin with. Like I said, the original community that came here has moved on in RL. Most of us don't have time for this anymore. I certainly don't. If FOG suddenly revived and became stronger than it ever had before, I still would not, could not, come back. Frivolous writing is a thing of the past for me. If I write now, it has to be for a purpose.

So why am I writing this? Because I loved this community, the good people and the bad. I appreciate what this forum did for me, and how much I learned. Not just in writing (which was tremendous), but also in social interaction. I feel like I owe it to any who read this to explain, even though I know that none of you will listen. Because you never did before.

We don't often see eye to eye on shit, but this is one of those uncommon occasions.

Not saying that this site is as good as dead yet... But fluctuating activity is the unavoidable reality of these sites. Sometimes it's busy and extremely active for years on end, and sometimes it goes dead forever and ever.

I'm going to RP whilst I'm here, then I'll probably fuck off again for a while. Then I'll probably be back and do it all over again, and if I can't get an RP off the ground or find one I like... Then I'll bitch and moan and be nasty to all of you.

So you can save yourselves the hassle now and fuckin ban me.

[Guilty Carrion]

Ysopet, I fucking love you. Don't ever change. XD

[quakernuts]

I will say that I do agree with Ysopet on the fact that we, as roleplayers, have caused the death of this site.  The coming, the going, the disappearing completely, it all just accumulates until you come to what we have today.  

A dead FoG.

I disagree with you on nearly every other point Ysopet.  

1)  The IRC is to blame for FoG's death!  

I will admit, the shitstorm that was caused by the closure of the IRC was huge, crippling, and overly unnecessary.  Yes I was part of it, no I'm not proud of my actions, but neither am I going to hide it.  The fact of the matter is this.  A good quarter, possibly more of the site used that IRC to talk, get to know each other, share laughs, stories, and ideas.

Fate came in, after one of her usual 9-12 month absences, and started rolling out changes.  Normally, I would say this is her prerogative, but the IRC was something that no one wanted changed.  The people who used it were against it, and everyone who didn't didn't care what happened to it.  With one move, she and everyone who helped her do it angered a good quarter of the site for no decent reason.  If I remember correctly, she wanted it shut down because it wasn't a full part of FoG.  How could that be when you had a healthy population from FoG in there?

The fact of the matter is that that change was not necessary, and not wanted.  We vocally stated so, and eventually mods were slipping into the IRC to spy on us to see what we were saying.  I know several mods who would come in there to speak there mind, make us think that at least we had a voice to the admins, and suddenly they lost their posting because they weren't backing Fate (Who was confirmed was spying on us in the IRC).  

Things spiraled from there, there was outward and blatant lack of respect to mods after that, words were stated, posts were made, and eventually things just came to a head where eventually neither side was right, but the IRC people weren't mods.  

You want to blame the IRC people for the death of this site?  Tell the whole story, not just your side.  

2) The next point I want to address is a specific line that you inputted into your post.  

"and as befits those who have committed sin, they now reside in Role-Play Hell" - Ysopet

Now I know you're not calling out names, but as someone who has joined that site from here, I can't help but feel offended.  

As of right now, I'm in one of the longest lasting and still running RP's on this site.  (Viemera: Essence of Deceit).  I have faithfully stayed with this site for...over 5 years I believe.  I have participated in many RP's, tried to host one and failed, and generally been active within the community.  Before the IRC fell, I was in there on a regular basis.  Hell, for a while the Chat Snippet's thread couldn't go 2 posts without my name somewhere in there.  

What I'm trying to say is this.  Do not generalize.  You have said this, and in this one line lost a ton of respect from me.  I know a few people who have moved over to the site, and I would say all of them were faithful to this site up until recently.  None of them have 'sinned' as you have put it.  We simply recognize what is going on.  This site is dying.  We're moving on because we still want to roleplay, we still want to write and create, and this site cannot provide that anymore.  

3) Where is the Admin?

I'm going to say this because everyone seems to be tip toeing around the issue.  The fact of the matter is that it has to be said.  

Where is our Admin?  Where is Fate?  

If you've noticed the URL change, that means the subscription hasn't been paid.  Which means she's no longer funding the site.  Which means, unless one of you guys wants to start paying the bills for the site's maintenance, this web page is going to be shut down sooner rather than later.  

You start talking about people disappearing, and yet the person who started the site and is supposed to be moderating everything is the worst of the bunch.  In the five or so years I've been on this site, I can recall at least 3 times where's she's disappeared for over 6 months without so much of a word.  Yes, Real Life comes first, yes this is just a site.  Yes to any other relevant statement you might have.  Fact of the matter is, you want the worst offender of that?  I would show you, but it appears she's no longer among us.  

In conclusion, your finger pointing and name calling is unappreciated and uncalled for and slightly inaccurate.  I agree that people coming and going without so much as a wave have crippled the site, but it's shit like what you're trying to start is what killed it.  

I will stay with the site until Viemera either finishes or dies, and then I'll be moving on. To those of you who are creating and moving on to a new site, good luck to you. To everyone else, it's been a pleasure.

[Dio the Awesome]

.

[Kaito]

Dio: it is not wise to continue with this website if no one has access over it. I mean not only can't you change the templates, you can't add features, it is hard to get a domain name registered for it and most of all, it will always be on the mercy of Fate. She could have a bad day and simply delete the whole thing. One click, all your effort gone. I personally don't have enough trust in her to ignore that.

[Knifey Keith]

Oh and Keith.  Was it really necessary to quote the whole post?

Yes, yes it was.

[Gunneh]

Oh, and as a side note (perhaps you will take it into consideration in your new home), the poison that really killed this place was the IRC. Why do you think Fate tried to get rid of it? And was her attempt met with understanding and open arms? No, it was not. Like a cigarette, you all inhaled that poison, embraced its noxious fumes, and then left the catasprophe to the truly dedicated, like Gadreille (and as befits those who have committed sin, they now reside in Role-Play Hell). Well, the damage has been done. It was only a matter of time to begin with. Like I said, the original community that came here has moved on in RL. Most of us don't have time for this anymore. I certainly don't. If FOG suddenly revived and became stronger than it ever had before, I still would not, could not, come back. Frivolous writing is a thing of the past for me. If I write now, it has to be for a purpose.

I'll have you know that I've quit smoking since then, good sir.  Also, I'm pretty sure Fate pardoned myself and the rest of my IRC comrades before I took my leave.

Also...you know...the site is dying almost two years (maybe more) after my little explosion happened.  The FoG IRC has been long since abandoned and we've moved on to more awesome things like playing Xbox together and gossiping about which boys from our third period we think are cute.

Wait...I think I'm crossing my references there...  Whatever.

P.S.  Hello to anyone I haven't spoken to in a while  I've missed you all, you lovable bunch of rapscallions!

[Sunwolf007]

Well, this topic certainly got lively in the last 24 hours. I think I shall start with where I last posted and respond to things in the order they were brought up.

Kaito: I do agree that while FoG was awesome in its own way I want to separate my site from FoG and in doing so I will not make a clone of FoG but will hopefully make a better site that may last longer. To that regard I am considering all suggestions for things that FoG didn’t have like a reputation system and other nifty features that make forum life easier or more fun. I am open to all suggestions about the new site. The things I add will hopefully give everyone something to like about the site. It was never my intention to clone FoG, just use it as an inspiration.

Shekinah: When it comes to paying for the site there are others (myself included) that would take care of that. I also have very many fond memories of this place and that is the reason I am making Asylum, to continue the legacy of FoG in my own way. All I would need form you is to sign up for Asylum and post.

Ysopet & Quakernuts: I appreciate your steadfastness to the site. It is quite honorable, although I am not interested in discussing in great depth the ‘reasons’ for the failure of FoG. The only result of such a discussion will be hurt feelings and bad blood. I am using this topic to try and rally people towards Asylum. I know this may feel like a treasonous act, and I do feel quite treacherous for doing it, but I would not act in such a manner unless I felt the situation was dire. I loved this site and it is from that love my desire to create Asylum was born in. Believe me or not but I have no reason to lie, and those who have RPed with me in the past know I don’t keep things hidden unless they are story related. I wish you luck in your future endeavors.

Dio: I agree that I would love to hear Kathryn’s thoughts on the subject. I have seen her logged in and expected a response. I do agree that her opinion matters greatly on FoG. Those ‘Adminy things’ that we are missing access to are going to eventually effect the site when upgrades come out, like the white background in the reply boxes. It is best to use a site that the staff can fully modify. If the site ever got hacked there would be no one to restore it and FoG would die instantly. So yes those Adminy things may not seem like much now but trust me, they matter greatly. I agree that we should use a site that the staff has complete control over without the possibility of a wild card.

Now onto my news about Asylum: I am in need of someone with Photoshop abilities to create the images for the new site. I can’t do it and my web guy’s computer is on the fritz. If you know of anyone who can help let me know or if anyone here can help me please speak up! I don’t know many Photoshop capable people so I am at a bit of a loss here. Otherwise progress is being made on Asylum. New suggestions from EoS and Kaito are being looked into. I still don’t have a timetable for the new site but if you all are not going to be disappointed with a rough look for the first couple of weeks I could get it open much faster. If you all want to wait around for a fully created site that looks awesome I can keep it closed until then.

[Dio the Awesome]

I have some rudimentary skills in photoshop. If you let me know kinda what you are looking for, I could give it a whirl.

[Sunwolf007]

Mostly what I need right now is the creation of some basic images to replace the stock images on the site. Like the post ranking images, the new topic button, the post reply button and things like that. It will look a lot better when it matches the color scheme we have picked out for the site. I will supply the base images but you would have to modify them to what we need. You think you could handle that?

[Dio the Awesome]

I can give it a shot. Just send me the stuff. If I'm having difficulties I'll just let you know, and you can find someone more skilled.

[Sunwolf007]

Sounds good. Will PM you the image links with instructions tomorrow. I have to get it all organized first.

[Gadreille]

OK, first off I have no idea how it happened, but I edited Dio's fucking post and deleted everything. I DON'T KNOW WHY THAT HAPPENED, SO SORRY.

In response to what you were saying (which is now gone because I've been at work for 14 hours and obviously I can't function):

@Dio:

It isn't that letting the site burn out is PREFERABLE, it's that none of you very opinionated people were around when the staff and I were trying to revive it, and WE are burnt out. I'm not going to go digging around this site for you guys just because now you decide you want something. If you want a new FOG, go make it. If you want to post here, post here. It's up to you, but I'm not responding to any of this thread unless you have a direct question (like now).

Every time you blame administration, you blame me. And I've done nothing but work my toosh off for this site. I am tired. And all the stuff going on here doesn't make me (or anyone else on the staff, including the admin I was referring to) anxious to get involved.

[Knifey Keith]

Dio, the reality is that this site, as with all of them… It's a dictatorship.

One or more people have admin powers/status.

And you don't.

[Tartra]

Why is it when a site is dying… Everyones solution is to make a thread and talk shit.

Just RP.

Keith, you're awesome. I know you know that, but I like saying it.


Ten and I have been moving our RP to Roleplaygateway. Honestly, while the main focus is to just have somewhere stable to host our work, I like the token of recognition I can get over there. I can read and review other people's stuff and they can do that with mine. We put a buttload of ourselves into this story and since I'm only interested in it, uploading it again to a site where it's like, although we love it and want to have others to chat about it, it'd go ignored. After three years, I don't want it ignored.

@Dio - Other people (non-Mods) were trying to help too, but regular members are limited in what they can actively do since it's not our site. The administration here is over saturated and no one seemed to be able to get on the same page with each other. It was ten people independently working to fix the problem and getting independently burnt out or held up by the lack of community-to-mod discussion.

The best jobs were the hardest jobs that no one wanted to delegate and then got mad no one was helping. The 'member of the month' thing alone was a good idea. The monthly highlights were the best. They had people excited to have their work showcased and it was a small goal to have people interested. Both were poorly run. Then Weir(?) left after ages of saying it was so much work but oddly never getting (or having it suggested) somebody else to take the edge off, so that disappeared and - well... That's why I'm at Roleplaygateway. They didn't stop. Hell, I think they even automated it. Way better.

Don't blame the mods. DON'T blame the non-mods. Don't blame each other for blaming each other. No one had the 'concentrated effort' thing working from the very start. It's just that it's finally caught up.

I like having TOKoR here, by the way. This place has good memories despite some of those things.

[Gadreille]

Agreed on all points, Tartra. I'm glad your role play found the recognition it deserved.

And for the record, I tried to get Member of the Month back on. I also tried to implement several other ideas you gave me. I tried to take away that staff division that became so strong during Weiss' time. But you are right, I was one person in a sea of we-don't-fucking-care (on both sides of the glass, I might add).

And I guess I have to repeat myself (something I am loathe to do but the point did not get across); this site can be edited. Features can be added. The template can be changed. The moderating team can be changed. But so far everything FOG-related has been to bash on one person or another. If anyone wants to RP here, then do it. The rest will come with time. If you don't, then move on and let this place RIP.

[Dio the Awesome]

I'd just like to make one rebuttle before I begin my back pedalling marathon.

It has been pointed out that if something does go wrong (even if it is unlikely) like hacking, or forum motion issues or what have you, then without Fate we are doomed anyways.

---

It was never my intention to blame anyone for any reason. If any of my posts did so directly, or were precieved in that fashion, then I am truly sorry.

While I don't remember everything I said in the post that Gad accidently wiped, much of it was backlash to Ysopets post and I can understand that it could have been taken that I was upset at the FoG community in general. It was not meant to be taken that way.

I understand why those of you who stuck around are frustrated and upset. This place meant a lot to all of you, that's clear through the efforts you have made. From what I've heard, it's remarkable that there even was a FoG for me to come back to. Thanks for keeping the lights on, for what that's worth.

(I'm at work, on break, so I'm ending the post here. I don't want to accidently tarnish this apology anyways. Oh. And this post is backed up, incase Gad tries to quote me again. <3 )

[Gadreille]

I will stay far, far away from the quote button >.<

But yes, I fear that without access to the full panel, there will be a brick wall to run into at some point or another.

However, for all I know, giving access to that part of the forum might have been impossible for Fate. I know that she did try to pass it on to Kathryn and faced a problem. I do not know if it was personal information she wanted to protect or if it was not possible due to forumotion limitations. However, it was attempted.

[Tartra]

I didn't know you were working on MotM, Gadreille, but I do know you stepped up to help with the contests. I don't think I thanked you for that, so thank you - for both. At the risk of sounding like a kiss-ass, you, Ysopet and Kalon (and Kathryn, when she was around) have been remarkably devoted, but you've set yourself apart in how active you've been in the community. Good on you. I'm happy to have had you as my mod.


I want to give more focused advice for the next steps anyone takes running some place. It's two things: a bored community is a dead community, and make your staff reflective of that community's needs. In other words, engage your writers as writers and fully separately as part of the community. We're here TO write and showcasing our work gets us excited. Commending our loyalty has us invested as loyal members. Don't ever forget to play up to both sides of that. It'll keep you busy, but the members are your customers and it's now your job to have them wanting to join in. If someone isn't interested in being a staff member to drive towards that goal, they aren't staff, and if they aren't actively making your writers entertained or enabling them to entertain themselves, they aren't good staff.

I'm not fond of FoG's mod structure. I see the most active mods restricted to one board and the least God-knows-where. When the community is this small, you don't need ten people running it, especially not this dividedly. Cut it down, make everyone who's in charge fully in charge (i.e., Global) so I don't have to guess who's able to help me, and keep checking if they're doing their jobs. More than once, I thought someone only got promoted as a shiny 'I've been here a while' badge. That's not a good impression to give. It's nice that they're liked, but if they can't help, show them they're liked in a different way. As a member. Of a month.

[Gadreille]

Pretty much I was trying to bring it in along with the contests and that big FOG open RP idea. But I was told there was not enough activity to warrant doing it yet. Pretty much if I wanted it done I had to do it myself. Considering my real life working schedule it was not feasible. I also was trying to give members the ability to self - govern (the contests were set up to be able to be run by members; the moderator rule was put in place just in case a member needed help with editing or something).

I agree with your set up. I ran into wall after wall as a member trying to give to the community (Emoria was too big to run without editing powers). Even as an OOC mod I felt limited. Even though contests was my idea and I wrote a majority of its rules and such, I didn't want to be the one to post it up because I was only an OOC mod. I also didn't have the ability to replace members of the staff who were not active. I did encourage activity a lot (A LOT) behind the curtains and on stage. None of it caught on though.

(I realize I am breaking FOG's staff discussion rule but seeing as this is the end I would like to make my efforts public).

[Sponsored content]