The Future of Education

[Guest]

Every faculty and staff member of the Cal State University system has to take 6 furlough days per quarter, as well as a ten percent pay cut. California is broke. Cal State is broke. The Cal State University system is no longer accepting any new admissions, period, for at least two years, if not more. They keep raising tuition costs, decreasing the amount of education we are receiving, and screwing us all. Class sizes are increasing, able professors are decreasing. The education system in California (and elsewhere, I'm sure) is stagnating. And I'm stuck in the middle of it, with no money and too many bills. I can't leave school for a year to work full time, because I won't be able to get back in. I can't quit working and look for a new job that is closer to home, because I may not find another job. So I have to continue spending the gas money to get to and from work and school, digging myself into an even deeper hole, for the next year or so. And then I can start paying it back. But for what? Is my bachelor's degree even going to be good enough by then to get me out of Albertsons?

We might as well just get rid of teachers and have uniform tests across all universities. The students buy the books, read the books, take online tests, and get their degrees. That is what they are worth now, so why not just head in that direction? Then they don't have to worry about paying professors shit money to babysit a classroom. I need to move out of California or I'm going to go crazy. There is no future here, not for my wife's brothers, not for my own son. Definitely not for me.

[Igraine]

I understand only a small portion of your frustration, Silvone, but I can't blame you for it in the least. I lived in California from 2002-2004 - and the only reason my family could afford to live there was because I got [rather crappy but at least livable] on-base housing "for free," because I was in the military. My son was in elementary school at the time, and went to the local on-base public school - and I can tell you I was genuinely shocked at what had to be the single worst public school program of any I had seen in the nation. (I grew up in upstate New York, and my son had been to schools in both Texas and Kansas before we went to Cali) There were absolutely NO extracurricular ANYTHING there - no art program, no music program - NOT EVEN A REAL PHYS ED COACH FOR PE! To meet the "PE requirements," the normal classroom teachers set aside time during the day to go literally run the kids around the yard outside. I'm not kidding.

Even the classroom teaching was mediocre at best - overall, I've never seen such a sham of a public school in my life. When I was discharged, my husband and I VERY briefly considered staying in California, but there was absolutely NO way we could have afforded it, and not had to send our kids to some craptacular public school. The only other viable option would have been for me to stay home and home school them - the problem being that (1) home schooling seems to be a dirty word in some parts of California, and (2) we could never have afforded the rent, much less a mortgage, anywhere near commuting distance to a place he could have worked, without me taking a job as well. (hence, big "no" on the home schooling)

And this was five years ago.

If it's even an option for you, I'd recommend getting out of California. That place is in a fiscal spiral that's getting scary to behold, as you are unfortunately living the consequences of. : ( The confiscatory tax rates have run many businesses away, along with all the "rich people" (read: small business owners) who take their jobs and money elsewhere in the nation. Just be sure to be careful if you do leave, not to go to another state where the combination of "high personal and business tax rates" and "high costs of 'social and government spending'" go hand in hand. It's just a recipe for absolute disaster.

[Gadreille]

I wish it were that easy. To pick up and leave this behind us is exactly what we need to do...but life is never black and white that way.

We have to finish school, and we have to do it here. There is no way we can afford out of state tuition, and I'm not waiting 2 years to finish the 6 classes I need to get a bachelors. So we have to stick it out.

Also, I am very close with my family, and to ask Silvone to move is to ask my parents, brothers, grandparents, and possibly Silvone's family to move as well. My mother's job gives my family the health care they need to survive - to give that up is risking everything right now.

[Igraine]

That's really unfortunate, Ryona. Nope, never thought it would be easy - I was more or less commisserating with your husband's frustration, and agreeing wholeheartedly with his last paragraph. Hopefully someday you will all find a solution that will get you out of there and on to a better life, to everyone's satisfaction.

[Gadreille]

After we recieve our degree we can think about moving to Arizona. We've lived there before and enjoyed it very much, and my family even tried to move there with us, though my dad never found a job. Maybe this time around we can try again - I don't mind separating from them on the short term, but living apart from them for the rest of my life just isn't an option.

Also there is a part of me that loves California. I was born and raised here - it has nothing to do with politics or finances or snootiness or patriotism (or however you call it when it is loyalty to the state...) This is my homeland, this is where my ancestors came from, and I guess I had hoped that my son could be raised here as well. It's hard for me give up something I'm attached to.

(I've got to go to class, so this got cut short...)

[The Melancholy Spirit]

Attached to California? Man, if only I felt that way. There is a little part of me that accepts this place as home and everything, but I really hate it here. The summers are too hot, the politics are ridiculous and education is a joke.

I haven't even tried to attend college myself. Stupid, probably, but I never saw it as something that would get me anywhere. I can't sit in a class and learn things anyway, the only way I learn is through independant study really. If I'd gone to college it would have been for music, writing, or photography. But where I live all these kinds of classes are going to do is help get mediocre knowledge of them and maybe some skill. Can't afford to transfer out of state or use loans for a better college, because by the time I had the degree I'd be in debt until my grave.

Thus, I saw it all as pointless. Perhaps I am simply too much of a cynic, but in the end I don't even care for a lot of money. As long as I can be accountable in my own way and be able to afford things I enjoy (music, books, concerts, weekend trips, games, etc) then I'll be happy. Even if that means I have to live with a roommate for the rest of my life.

[Fate Flyer]

I didn't realize California was suffering so heavily right now, though I've heard the unemployment rate is pretty high there. It sounds absolutely terrible. From your outlook, it really further makes me not want to consider ever living there.

I've been researching places to live for awhile now, comparing the cost of living, along with every other little detail (like the crime rates, the population, the unemployment rates, etc.). Originally, Tony (onenitedrive) and I were planning on moving out to Seattle, Washington after I graduate next year, but slowly and surely we decided against it. (Sorry, Shades! It would have been so cool to meet you too!) We just decided that it didn't seem like our kind of place, and with the cost of living being even more than here, which we already consider too much, it just wasn't a right fit.

I also had to look at major cities too, since the video game companies are all located only in big cities. I was looking all around the country, the most prominent ones in Texas, California, and Arizona. California has the most jobs for what I'm going to be doing, but it's just so ungodly expensive, and from what I've heard from people that live there, owning your own home in that state is a privilege, which does not sound good to me. I visited California for a vacation a few years back, and I absolutely loved it. It was most definitely one of my favorite states, what with how beautiful it was, its proximity to the ocean, the mountains, everything to do, etc. However, what's turned me off to it mostly is just the cost. It's true you typically make more there, as their cost of living is far above the national average, but the average salary for someone starting out in my field, no matter what state, is between $30,000-$40,000, and if $2,000 of that is going to living in an apartment each month, not counting utilities or groceries, there's just no way we could ever afford to save for a house.

What's funny is, a girl in my school was just giving a speech today on all this too. She even did the same research as me and found out all the same things. Ultimately, her decision even ended up being the same as ours! We've decided that we most likely will be moving to the Phoenix area of Arizona. The cost of living in that state is just unbelievably low, and you can get a really nice place for such a low amount, unlike any other big city, except for those perhaps in Texas. (I decided against Texas because, firstly, I've never been then, whereas I've actually been to various states out west, and also because I don't think we'd really fit in there.)

So, if you guys end up moving to Arizona, onenitedrive and I might not be far! My dad retires in a couple of years, and he, my mom, and my younger brother will be moving out to New Mexico (most likely, unless they also decide on Arizona), so thankfully I won't have to be leaving them behind in Illinois.

So, yeah. If California is having major issues with their educational system (which, oh God, Chicago can relate), I definitely don't want to start a family there. It's probably just a nice place to visit instead of to live.

[Guest]

Wow! Ryona and I went to Arizona State University for a year. We absolutely loved it there. ASU is in Tempe, Phoenix. We really want to go back, but like Ryona said in her post it will be a bit difficult. If we do end up leaving California, it will most likely be to return there. I would love to get my Masters degree at that school.

And, of course, it would be an honor to someday meet the FOG Mother

[The Melancholy Spirit]

Man, I feel like the odd one out here. Everyone talking about moving to hot states while I'd rather move to somewhere cold with very short summers...

[Guest]

I despise the cold. With a very hot passion.

[Fate Flyer]

That's so cool that you both attended Arizona State for a year, Silvone! I'm happy to hear too that you both loved it there. I never got to see Phoenix or Tucson, but I was in Las Vegas and also got to see the Grand Canyon in AZ, and I really loved the country out that way. The heat was incredible when we arrived in Vegas though. It was 114 degrees, and yet, despite how hot it was, we could be outside all day and not sweat, since there was no humidity. It was the oddest feeling I've ever experienced like that, and I really loved that (since we have so much humidity out here, and I just hate sweating when I'm not doing anything).

I hope that whatever happens for you guys, you can manage to be happy and content. That's the major thing.

It would be great to meet you guys too! ^^

I've always loved warm weather. I absolutely despise winter and everything it encompasses: snow, ice, driving accidents, walking accidents (lol), freezing! Not everyone is a warm-weather person, which is just fine.

[Igraine]

Man, I feel like the odd one out here. Everyone talking about moving to hot states while I'd rather move to somewhere cold with very short summers...

/packs up a kindred, heat-disliking Spirit, because I'm sure he's light and won't add much to my shipping costs.

/takes to Alaska with, to the beautiful land of short summers and far cooler weather...

[The Melancholy Spirit]

See, I'm the exact opposite. I am sick of the 100+ weather we have all summer long here. 75 is pushing it for me and then we have these days that reach over 111...ugh.

[Fate Flyer]

From the pictures Shade shared earlier in the photos thread, Alaska looks like a lovely and beautiful place to live if you love the cold weather.

[The Melancholy Spirit]

Yeah, I hope to visit there sometime. I spent two weeks up near Seattle, outside of the twon Puolsbo (sp?) where some of my family live. Really liked it up there.

My dream home would be somewhere in Finland though. I just need to learn Finnish first and then get enough money to immigrate, or try to at least.

[Kathryn Lacey]

I heard on the news how California fucked up and spent all of its money, so they've been printing hundreds of "I owe you"s. That really sucks that you guys seem to be stuck there until you can finish college. =\

I really can't relate. I have yet to attend college, but my high school was a part of a really good educational system with a lot of extracurricular activities for just about anything for which anyone had a desire. We had drama, IHSSA, band, chorus, chamber choir, football, soccer, baseball, basketball, dance, chess club, etc. I also had an amazing teacher for my weight training class, and I learned more about taking care of my body than I ever had in any school anywhere ever. However, that was more because he used to be a personal trainer, so he actually taught us why we needed to keep in shape rather than giving us a ball and telling us to have-at-it.

Anyway, I also wanted to add that if you don't have an amazing job, living in Phoenix is total crap. I also wouldn't want to raise kids there ((not that I want kids, but if I had them, Phoenix would be the last place to which I brought them)). I know when I lived in Phoenix, two different men ((strangers mind you)) tried to get me into their cars, and I was hugged by a smelly, drunken homeless man who invited me to a drug party.

I will never live in Phoenix again for the rest of my life. I probably won't even visit that city again, let alone that state. In Flagstaff, some strange man who gave me a horrific vibe though he looked perfectly normal, was going to offer to give me a ride from which I probably never would have returned had my taxi not showed up. My mom was across the street trying to get us food when she got a terrible feeling and saw him start to walk up, so she came running back as fast as she could. Yeah... I may have been born there, but I'm content with never going back.

[Fate Flyer]

Ouch, that's horrible about California.

I remembered that you had a bad experience with that man offering you a ride, Kathryn, since you told me that story before. xD That would be creepy, especially that guy inviting you to a drug party!

I think there are probably a lot of really odd and very bad people that live in any city though, to be fair. Take Chicago for example: Tony/Axiom works with some guys that live right in downtown Chicago, a couple of them who actually live in the neighborhoods and on the streets that are in the news constantly for gangs and shootings. According to those guys, it's like the ghetto and is really dangerous. Apparently, a lot of bad stuff goes on there that I'd prefer not to know about. At the same time, you get people who have a ton of Chicago pride and who think this city is the best city in the country. (That is the farthest from our opinion as possible though lol.)

No matter what, I never, ever want to live in any big city at all, no matter where in this world it might be, be it LA, Chicago, Berlin, London, Tokyo, or even Phoenix. I'd much rather live outside the city, preferably a good hour or so, and if I need to, I would commute everyday for my job. Like you know, Kathryn, Tony and I are originally from the Quad Cities, which is just 3 and a half hours away from Chicago, and it's like a whole different world out there. People are friendly and considerate, which is the total opposite from here by Chicago.

In my own opinion, no matter where you are, the big city is going to suck. City life and its people are most definitely not for either Tony or I. That said, when we do move, we won't be living in the city. However, my job requires me to live close to a major city, as all video game companies are located in big cities (as listed on http://www.gamedevmap.com/), so no matter what, we're going to have to be at least within driving distance of a big city.

[Kathryn Lacey]

Where the hell did you live in the Quad Cities? ^o_O^ I know that Bettendorf had nicer people than Davenport... but there was always a serious lack of genuinely kind people.

I do think you would have an easier time living in Peoria or some other suburb of Phoenix. I lived in Peoria when I was little, and there were really nice people who lived there. I would have mentioned Glendale, too, but, if I remember correctly, after I grew up, that place went seriously downhill.

[Fate Flyer]

Lol oh really? That's so crazy. I always thought the QC was a really nice area, all small-town like. Everyone always seemed neighborly. xD I guess Davenport might be a little different, since that's one of the biggest towns, so that's probably why.

Oh, there's a Peoria in AZ too? Ahh, that's neat that you lived there also. (You're at least lucky you got to experience living in different places growing up!) Hmm. We still have more researching to do. I just hope that whatever place we decide on, we'll be happy!

[Guest]

You should have seen the crazy native American man that Ryona and I met on a bus in Tempe one night. He was quite obviously drunk...and he wanted to show us the lizard he had a small black bag with him. If there was actually a lizard in that thing, it was probably dead. The man wouldn't leave us alone, so we eventually got off the bus and walked down the street a ways, at night, to another bus stop and finished the ride home in relative peace.

[Fate Flyer]

You should have seen the crazy native American man that Ryona and I met on a bus in Tempe one night. He was quite obviously drunk...and he wanted to show us the lizard he had a small black bag with him. If there was actually a lizard in that thing, it was probably dead. The man wouldn't leave us alone, so we eventually got off the bus and walked down the street a ways, at night, to another bus stop and finished the ride home in relative peace.

D: *shudders* I really do not enjoy creepy people. Lol.

[Gadreille]

You should have seen the crazy native American man that Ryona and I met on a bus in Tempe one night. He was quite obviously drunk...and he wanted to show us the lizard he had a small black bag with him. If there was actually a lizard in that thing, it was probably dead. The man wouldn't leave us alone, so we eventually got off the bus and walked down the street a ways, at night, to another bus stop and finished the ride home in relative peace.

No, he admitted it was dead. He wanted to show us his dead lizard. I was more worried that he was using a metaphor than an actual dead lizard...*nervous laugh*

[Squall Reyes]

*clears throat* As a life long Californian.(Except those 4 years in Seattle. Best 4 years of my life mind you.) I'd like to say yes we are in a ton of trouble. And yes out educational system is a mess, my mother is a teacher (one of the best according to the many kids and parents I talked to) and has been for the last 20 years. Her school (inner city school....-.- aka hell) is one of the only school in her district to still have a working music/sport/extra educational activities. And that is only because her a few teachers from that school had fought the damn bureaucracy that is the American Educational System till they finally relented to the schools claims.

But how did we get here, how did it get to the point in California where teachers had to fight the state and sometimes FEDERAL government for what they need to give the coming generation an education. How did we get to the point where we truly were using IOU's (which has stopped by the way) how did we get to the point where in California the DMV and Post Office has to take at least 2 working days off in the month? (usually the first Tuesday and 3rd Thursday of the month) Well I recall a line that is said fairly often in film, radio and books. "If you are looking for the culprits Californians you need only to look in the mirror."

In the 1920's the Californian people came up with a....I suppose a experiment in government. The proposition system. It was used quietly or a year or two and quietly went away. But in the 1970's the bastard times of the "Me" generation. Some one had dug up the fail experiment and saw an opportunity to increase it's power so that no major public works projects and tax increases would have to be voted on. BY THE PEOPLE. Now...this might sound like a good idea to some of you at first, but think about this. If you were offered a chance to never pay taxes again. Would you take it?

Well the state of California sure has, in fact since the 70's just in this last in election there was 2 props that were on the table, to increase taxes so they could you know....NOT use IOU's and another to begins talks of public works projects to...I don't know CREATE jobs. They were both SOUNDLY defeated. Not only that but, what is also unique to our state government is the fact that our state government leaders have term limits....2 terms really. Now many may say well the president does why shouldn't a state government.

Here some facts for you all. California’s budget is enormous: If California were a separate country, it would rank among the ten largest economies in the world, with a GDP similar to that of Italy, and it would be 35th among the most populous countries. This makes statewide budgetary decisions immensely complex, and such decisions would ideally require thoughtful deliberation: the very opposite of how the proposition process is implemented in California. Instead of having a decade or more to learn and master the great complex puzzle (and yes some will exploit it) the politician only has 8 years. (Which means those few who explot the system now only have 8 year which means he's gonna BUTCHER it.)

And even if the state government official figures out how to fix the budget/economy he would still have to take it to...you guess it the proposition system. *Face and palm people face and fucking palm* The government is currently trying to push a light rail system to be built. From LA to San Fran, the trip would last 2 hours, its 8 hours driving. It would cost about half as much as a plane trip. This would create thousands of jobs on the short term (3-5 years to build) on the construction of this system. Plus hundreds of long term jobs for maintenance, security and ect ect. Not to mention the convince for people in San Fran to take a DAY fucking trip to places like Disneyland, Hollywood, ect ect. Or for people in LA to go to Fisherman's Wharf, the Golden Gate bridge ect ect. That's called economic recovery for the two major cities in the United States biggest economy.

And in the end its funding will be decided by...you guessed it, the proposition system. We can blame Arnold, we can blame corrupt corporations or an inept government. But in the end the people of California need to look at ourselves and end the system and let law makers and government officials do their fucking job.

End rant.

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